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January 13, 2005

Comments

Outer Life

I don't consciously share your negative view of men. I say consciously because I realized while reading your post that I, too, have many more female friends than male friends. I think that's a reflection of my awe for women rather than any animosity towards men, but I'll have to think on it.

As to whether I'd've been better off without my father, I'd say no. It's complicated, to be sure, but I cannot imagine having grown up without him. I'm very sorry for your early loss. Each of my parents lost a parent when young and I believe neither ever got over it.

Ivy

Wow, Nate, beautifully put. I can't help but think that my father and Steven are two of the fellows that you dislike, here. On the topic of Big Dan, I agree. Though he is doing better than he was during my childhood (the icy breath of Death must be coaxing him from his previous neanderthalic tendencies), his absence while still young would have helped me turn out far better than I can even imagine. As for Steven, I still don't see the problem. *shrugs*
At any rate, Nat-o Potato, I love you, and always take your advice to heart because you are mostly "female-minded" and are always calm and reasonable in giving it. You never tell someone something, you let them know, if they'd like to hear it, and they may take it or leave it. No qualms to settle, no nerves to soothe.
You are the perfect man, Nate. You should know this, and I think that's what makes it alright for you to "male-bash" here, even though you clearly are not.

Cowtown Pattie

First - a big thanks to 2blowhards for the link to your excellent post.

My own father was no saint, but in the last decade of his life ( mostly due to his emphysema and being housebound from blinding macular degeneration), he became the person I always knew was there behind the cruel, alcoholic personna. I am grateful for the opportunity I had to forgive him, and bond more with the man he might have been had his personal demons not been in control most of his life.

My ex-husband's story is another page in my Book of Sorrows, but a long tale and does not have such a happy healing ending.

Marita

Your post hits home with me considering the fact that my daughter had a child with an alcoholic jerk and many times a day I think it would be better for their son to grow up without this alcoholic schitzoid because he will never know to follow such a bad example if the ahole is dead. Your post makes me realize such a scenario is possible.

Sluggo

I haven't spoken to my father in, jeez, I guess it's more than 20 years now. He wasn't as destructive a man as your father was. He was just a self absorbed, childish man who always found a way to service his needs and ignore everybody else's. I didn't mean to use the past tense in describing him, but the fact is, he's very past tense. There is a nagging thought that when he goes, and it won't be long now, I'll regret not reaching out to him. Maybe I will. But that doesn't mean it would be the right thing to do. Fuck him.

As for the rest, I have two brothers who are great fathers. I think I'm pretty good too. We had a pretty good role model to avoid.

Nate

Outer Life - Thanks for responding! For me, awe of women and animosity towards men have gone hand-in-hand, so it's tough to separate them. But it is complicated, isn't it? And why is it that whenever I shoot off making sweeping generalizations I'm compelled to backtrack and tick off exception after exception.

Ivy - You have me blushing down to my toes. Thanks.

Patty, Sluggo - it's a tough decision, whether to reconcile or not, isn't it? There's something to be said for accepting someone, faults and all, and then getting on with your own life. But then, I genuinely believe there are people out there who don't deserve to be forgiven. I mean, why should they get to make everyone around them miserable for their whole life and then lie on their deathbed feeling everything's okay in the end?

I've been doing a bit of reconciling with my grandfather now, after my grandmother's sudden death, and I have to say in this case I'm glad of it. It turns out that most of my fear and distrust of this guy resulted from misunderstanding and immaturity...but anyway, that's another long story.

Marita - Such an example is possible. Unfortunately it's much easier when the guy takes care of the business himself. Is your daughter still with him? Is she trying to tough it out? If not, does he have custody or any kind of visitiation rights?

Marita

Yes, she's still with him :(. She believes that it's better for her son to be raised in a family environment like she was, though god knows why she was attracted to an environment completely different from that which she was raised up in.
Also- I'm not saying anyone else will take care of the "situation", but that if something were to happen, life would be ok for their son.

Jesse

right now i am working on a trauma rotation at a city hospital in new jersey. the head surgeon of the department is the classic rediculous caricature of masculinity. what is extra amusing about him are the over the top lines he says--and i say lines because i feel as if he had to have practiced them at home before arriving at the hospital.
For example, we have a new medical student on the rotation. he plans on going into orthopaedics, and while we were working up a patient with a knee injury, he asked a question about this particular doctor's approach. this doctor then said to the questioning student, "you know, all students start this rotation with an "A". there are not enough letters in the alphabet for the grade you are gonna end up with if you don't shut up."
I feel this is the classic masculine maneuver: fall back on the rules of hierarchy when you are not in the mood to fulfill your duties (in this case, teaching the student). or even worse, maybe this doctor did not have a good explanation for why he was using this particular technique. none of us in the room can know the true answer, because this doctor used his position as head surgeon, together with a healthy dose of yelling/animosity to permanently close the subject for all who knew what was best for them.

Nate

Jesse -

That's hilarious (and frightening), thanks! From what you've told me, medicine sounds like an odd blend of the cutting-edge (technology! surgery! miraculous life-saving compounds!) and the midevil (hazing, rigid hierarchies, doctor-as-priest).

When are you going to start your own blog, by the way? You've got enough stories already to keep us reading for years. Or does, like, working in the ER kind of get in the way of writing-as-hobby?

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